Episode 30 – David DePoyster with Optum

RJ Martino  

Welcome to the iProvMade podcast where we help you build a more profitable practice. I got my co host here, Jordan Smith. Hey, Jordan,

Jordan Smith  

What’s up? RJ? How are you? 

RJ Martino  

I’m excited to get into the podcast. So right away, why don’t you just tell us who we got,

Jordan Smith  

We have David DePoyster with Optum Health. So you know, what’s interesting about this one is we always talk about how to build a successful healthcare practice. We’re excited to have David on and bring, bring his story to you guys, because he comes at it from a different perspective, from that investment perspective. So he talks a lot about the ways that he thinks about investment and being an active investor. So So those organizations or those people that are listening, that might be interested in, you know, either talking to an investor, or investing yourselves as a doctor, because like he says, you only make money as a doctor when you’re seeing patients. This is the podcast for you. So I want to hop right into it. Without further ado, David DePoyster with Optum. 

RJ Martino  

Jordan, I am super excited, because we’ve got our good friend, David DePoyster. Here on our podcast. David, welcome to the podcast.

David DePoyster  

Hey, great to be here. I appreciate the opportunity.

RJ Martino  

Well, I know you got a large and lengthy background. And I want to just jump in and kind of talk about your career and how you ended up where you are today.

RJ Martino  

Sure, I was really fortunate in the late 80s, to just stumble into orthopedic implant sales. And, and so that was just the, the zenith of that particular industry, there were new implants and instrument systems were developed that allowed us to do those surgeries, very reproducible, you know, up until then, they were not as reproduce, they weren’t as successful because they weren’t as reproducible. I happens a lot, you know, in the medical industry, once a new technique comes out, that that allows, you know, just about any practitioner to do it, well, you know, whether it be a drug, and, you know, they, we figure it all out, and then we know what symptoms to do, or or an implant were there, we got these instruments to where we could actually align the knee properly, easily. So you didn’t have to have done 5,000 of them, you could do one, and the instructions were there. And you could do it right as a clinician. So I happened to be there at that, that that pivotal time. And it was a real blessing. And I had a banker after I was a sales rep for about four years. And one of my doctors fathers was the CEO of First Commercial Bank, his name is William Bowen. Bill Bowen is the law school here is named after him. And Mr. Bowen believed in me, and he loaned me money that I did not deserve on paper. But he believed in me, and he loaned me money to buy the distributorship. And a few years later, I sold to publicly traded company and started a small fund. And I’ve been investing in and developing companies for over 23 years.

RJ Martino  

So for our audience, as healthcare professionals, some of them are not familiar with how fund management goes. Just a little background on that and what you’re focused on.

David DePoyster  

Yeah, it’s pure healthcare. I’ve never invested in anything other than medical, you know, health care related entities, company solutions, software’s implants, you know, everything was healthcare related. I didn’t stray from from health care, tried to stick with that, because it’s such a broad field anyway. And I didn’t think I needed to invest in, you know, a window company or a new biotech. That was something I didn’t understand. But it was I kept it to health care. 

RJ Martino  

Yeah. Well, so your role in that you obviously investigated a lot of different healthcare technologies. Were you raising money from other physicians? Okay, so this was no we didn’t, there were there were seven investors with me. And we just did three funds over the over that time. And usually a fund as you know, you acquire, we did eight to 10 companies in a fund, sometimes a little more, sometimes a little less. So we acquired or we got a piece of it more often than not, we just did what we were good at. And we’re typically what we would do is take a percentage of the deal that a larger PE firm, asked us to do due diligence. And then we we were the sales, marketing, development distribution people. And so we get in there and we’d find out alright, are they using 1099 reps? Are they calling on clinics? with, you know, W2 employee coming in what how are they building their, you know, what are they doing? And then if that was optimum, great, we keep doing that, and we’d support that. But oftentimes, we would maybe go with a strategic partner, we’d find a, you know, a large entity that could sell those products and stuff more efficiently. And we would, would get them to help us.

RJ Martino  

Wow, very interesting. So, across the board, you investigate a lot of those, you saw a lot about what organizations were doing right and what they were doing wrong, but you also influenced how they would operate, you’re saying that you would actually talk to them about whether partnering with a larger firm might make sense or not?

David DePoyster  

Right. Well, it’s much like if you if your audience, your administrators, in a clinic, I mean, you know, if you’re involved in your business that does better, you know, physicians that own their own business, if they don’t know what the, you know, what the bank account has in it, if they don’t know where the money’s going, if they don’t, that’s not a recipe for success. a recipe for success is having dashboards built and things built, you know, what’s going on in that in your business. And so, same with investing if you if you if you want to be a passive investor, great invest in S&P 500 index, and let it Let it go, let or let somebody else manage your your money because they’re at, you know, that’s active mutual fund, or whatever. But if you really, you know, if you want to do it, right, you have to be in it. And so, I mean, we got in it, and we got on the board, we were in operations, we we, I mean it was our money on the line. So we got very involved, and most of your large PE firms have a have a stable of management groups, that when they acquire, they move, they get their, their team, they’re putting entertainment, and we’ll keep some of that some of your team but our our team knows how to take something from here and get it to there. 

RJ Martino  

And it’s interesting that you say that because, you know, we’ve got a framework in which we kind of look at how to grow a business and are and I always look for opportunities to kind of talk about our framework. And Jordan, do you want to talk a little bit about our thoughts and our framework on how we go about building a profitable practice? 

Jordan Smith  

Yeah, absolutely. And that’s why I think, you know, that’s why that’s why we we tried so hard to chase David down. And luckily, he was, uh, he agreed to be on here. I know, a lot of listeners out there, probably most of them have heard of Optum. So right now, he’s the VP of strategic partnerships there. But, you know, this will make a lot of sense to you, David, because it sounds like you guys. But you know, first, we always start with the vision. And what is the vision of the organization. With with no vision, there’s, there’s no, there’s doesn’t make any sense to plan strategically, without a strategic plan, it makes no sense to even put any tactics in place. If you don’t know where it’s going, you know, you’re right, compared to a road trip where you don’t know where you’re going, it’s gonna be really hard to plan out the road trip, if you don’t know what the final destination is. Figure out where you want to go on that map, and then take ownership of the problem, you know, make sure that you get all the stakeholders together and figure out what what are the hurdles gonna be? And what are the things that we might face?

RJ Martino  

And that sounds easy. But David, you know, how many times have you seen patients who want to just throw money at a problem? iInvestors who wants to be passive investors, but they’ve signed up, they don’t realize a lot of them have been born into ownership of this practice, or they think they’re signing up to be a passive investor. And it’s, it’s like a surprise, if you want to get a return on this investment. You’ve got to be hands on, nobody’s going to fix this problem for you. You’ve got to get your hands dirty. And so for us, we’re not interested in talking to, you know, we’ll call them clients, we’re not interested in talking to these clients who aren’t interested in taking ownership of the problem. We say the good news, the bad news is this is all your fault. You got to get involved. Yeah, the good news is, this is all your fault, you’ve got the opportunity to change all this if you want to. But if you’re not going to, if you’re not the type of person to take accountability, we just can’t help you. 

Jordan Smith  

And you know, you know, we’re a, you know, probably a lot of people that we talk to, you know, money doesn’t solve everything. So it’s also triage in that issue. What What is the real problem? Are you are you trying to solve a symptom or, or or do you need to go deeper and figure out same as you know, for the doctors out there, I come to you because my throat sore, okay, that’s a symptom of a larger issue. And a lot of the time in business. It’s the same thing. If you just focus on the sore throat, you’re not really gonna hit to the root of the problem. Next thing is being able to track progress, you know, what, what, what manage what you can measure and knowing what those numbers are. And then one of the last things is making sure you engage your entire team. And we always kind of hit on that framework and, and, you know, our big belief is, is the same way that you need to run a practice, or a new you know, those, those kind of core tenants need to be in place in order to have a successful practice. So, talk to us a little bit about kind of where you are now and what you’re doing. And, and you know, how that plays along with the experience that you already mentioned that you’ve had in the past?

David DePoyster  

Yeah, well, from my past, I had a relationship with a management group, and that particular group, then when I sold my fund, and I wanted to, you know, like, they learn to play golf, and have a life and do different things. But I still want to work, I still want to have relationships, and I need that I need relationship mean, means a lot of my mental health, making friends, having good wine, great food, meeting new people, I mean, those are those things I want to do. And so seek out, you know, those relationships, and I want those. And so a friend of mine gave me the opportunity to work with a large company that I had worked with, and done due diligence, and, and, and all with before Optum. And it was just a blessing for me to be able to work with Optum. They’re a division of UnitedHealth Group, which is, you know, United Healthcare is one is our sister company, and they manage medical benefits. And then Optum as three different businesses, it’s Optum Health, which is all about, you know, practices, they have practices of ambulatory surgery centers, and those kind of things. And typically, that group partners with large health systems to help grow their outpatient revenue or grow that business, it’s very expensive to do that. Fortunately, Optum has the resources to grow those out, and then partner with strategic health systems and health plans to to bring down the costs. And we’ll talk about the the triple aim and the quadruple aim in a moment, because I think it’s very important, especially to your audience, because they’re a part of that. And then Optum is also OptumRx, which I deal with the majority of the time, which is a primarily a pharmacy, Pharmacy Benefits, the Pharmacy Benefits, not the medical benefit. And then we have some pharmacy services within that that are very special, which we’ll we’ll hit on. And then they are there’s Optum insight, which has all the data and analytics and revenue cycle management for large clinics, large integrated clinics. So that’s, that’s Optum. Today, and I did mention the triple aim, you hear the FM nomenclature that is utilized in healthcare quite a bit these days. And it speaks to you You may have heard it may not. But if you haven’t, it really speaks to what’s the triple aim? Well, it’s to provide better care, at lower cost, with better patient satisfaction, make patients happier, make make health care, you know, enjoy a lot Why should it be so bad? Why should it be so hard? Why should the patient experience needs to be better, but then I honestly believe in the quadruple aim. And the fourth one is the one that gets left out and it’s make it better for providers. So make the system better for providers. That is what I keep in mind when I work with you know major healthcare partners that are payers. That’s great. You know, we deal a lot with that we deal with plans with all that, but we deal a bunch with providers, health systems, doctors groups, and they are pummeled in this in this in this in this business, I mean it every day everybody asked the doctor to do more, everybody wants more from the from the provider will give us this information will do this for us. Check these 50 boxes and we’ll pay you do that and oh by the way, you should do this because it’s good for your patient. You should check in the EMR you should go in there and check this stuff and see which one’s cheapest. Well, by Gosh, passport. Yep. You know, I mean, help us you know, it does create win wins for for both. So honestly, Optum looks to do that, and I will give Optum a lot of credit.

RJ Martino  

I love that. Yeah. And you know, it’s funny because in every industry we we all agree you can have it better, faster or cheaper but you can’t have all three and we all agree that so you hear about Triple Aim all the time, and you hear, you know, better care, lower care satisfaction, one, you can’t have all three just like the better, faster, cheaper. But even if you do, the only way you do it is we keep putting more and more pressure on our providers. We keep writing gotta do more, you got to take home, we’re gonna, we’re gonna allow you to see people faster by giving you this tool. And, you know, our audience says, Look, I can’t do it all I’m taking. I’m taking cases home with me on the weekend. That’s the only time I get to do any of my required documentation. And so it sounds good. I know our audience. And I know they think how in the world does it happen? How does that actually happen? 

David DePoyster  

Well, David DePoyster doesn’t have all the answers. I do not have all the answers. But there are way there are successful things. And I’ll give you a real world example, with the almost five years ago now, six years ago, five or six years ago, I get a call, I got a call from a local general surgeon who specializes in bariatric surgery. And he said, Hey, I hear you’re from, we have a mutual friend. And he, we didn’t know each other, but we had mutual friends. And he says, hey, my, my buddy says you’re the guy to help start a medical company. And everything he goes, I’ve got a real need, I’m a matter of fact, I’m doing it. I cannot take care of my patients. And, and sit and look at a computer screen. And do this. My patients need me to touch them, look at them, form a relationship with them, they come to me with with multiple issues, you know, if you have Bariatrics, I mean, there’s, there’s psychological, there’s all kinds of issues, I need to connect with them. And he goes, I’m, I can’t do that. So I’m going to create a scribing service. Because I need somebody to, to not be in the room with me, but to listen. And how do I do that? And so we said, I said, All right, well, let’s, let’s do it, let’s figure one out, let’s figure out a HIPAA compliant way to record, you know, have somebody listen. So we did all of that we wrote standard operating procedures, those kinds of things. And, you know, he put up some money, I put up the money, a partner that came on to run the business, put in some money. And so we founded MedOptum, which is going concern right now in Little Rock. And we have, you know, quite a few clients, and we employ a good number of people as medical scribes. And, and this was created out of a physician, having a need, and seeing a provider. Seeing that there was a there was a problem, and coming up with a solution and founding a company. And now a going concern. And that is the opportunity. Never Never before have we had a better opportunity to to take an idea that solves a problem. And, and make money because you have accelerators, business accelerators, small investment groups, venture capital firms are throwing money at clinicians that have good ideas. And that will take the time to codify that to create it to patent you know, to do those things that you do to just just you know, protect your ideas and get your stuff and then actually create something that then you can sell. I mean that that’s the opportunity like never before, that are physicians and clinics that

RJ Martino  

there’s three points I want to unpack on that real quick one is Optum is huge. And so a lot of our providers would never think that optim would get in volved in some problem that is so small here and Little Rock. They are you talking about a global company?

Jordan Smith  

Oh, yeah. Yes. That’s like owning a bicycle shop and saying, well, Walmart Oh, help me out if I just Yeah, no.

David DePoyster  

Well, the thing is, if you create a new bike, that people like Walmart’s interested, yep. You know, they’re they’re interested. Now, Med Optum is not a part of Optum. All right, Med Optum was the name I came up with. But you know, for that that entity, okay? Because that’s what we were doing. We’re optimizing medicine that this was this is before I even went to work for Optum although it was like Med Optum. But optim itself is has a half a billion dollar venture firm that just invest in new technologies to meet these needs.

RJ Martino  

Well, they see it that was my second part. Is that you know, every venture, you walk into any of these venture groups, you go, and you listen to pitches, and you’re staring down at 22 year olds that you think, man, I’d love to be a 22 year old do this, if I only knew what I know now, and so a lot of these a lot, a lot of our audience is in the position where they have a problem, they have a need, but they also think, oh, that’s just for the kids. Are there an opportunity for our listeners to get involved, not just as kind of a, an investor to throw money, but actually involved in creating a solution like that.

David DePoyster  

Yes, and, and our physicians are, whether you’re a dentist, whether you’re a, you know, an MD, DO doesn’t matter what you are, most of most clinicians are, tell me, they’re, they do the work, they don’t, you don’t, you don’t make money as a doctor, when you’re not working. You know, you’re, you’re, you’re being paid for, for services. And so you got to perform those services are there, you’re not making money, when you’re sleeping, you know, that you just don’t they can on your investment.

RJ Martino  

When we go on vacation, they feel they feel it, I gotta get back in the office and make some money.

David DePoyster  

Anyway, I gotta make the money, you know, and, and I and I get that there’s that one of them. I teach. I’ve taught a class for about 14 years at UCA is basically an advanced medical sales class. So I just have five students and we, it’s more of a life 101 class, to be truthful, but we do a bunch of sales and, and everything, but in that class, they’re, they’re, you know, three books I recommend, but one of those three is the the E-Myth Revisited. And it’s all about, you know, a, you know, and you can just take a doctor, you know, a doctor who really likes, you know, making cakes, and people say, Oh, you should make these you should be a baker, you should quit what you’re doing, you shouldn’t do that. And one day he or she does and, and then all of a sudden golly, I was Hey, I used to have so much fun doing that. But now it’s been I got a I got more people to people with I got bills to pay. And, and of course, the moral to the E-Myth Revisited is take, and Fran basically franchise pretend like you’re creating a franchise, and you figure out all the stuff that you do, and you put it down and you make a system out of it. And so therefore, as you grow that business, when someone wants to buy, it’s much more valuable, because they can keep it going and they you’ve got the playbook, you know, you the McDonald’s, you put one score to this one score to that do leave that for all of that has to be documented, it has to be it has to be written down has to be put into or it has to be in a program it has to be it has to be memorialized. And then you get value from that. Well, so it’s funny, most of our clinicians don’t do that they don’t do that they’re most they just don’t take the time, they’re their golden handcuffs, you’re making good money as a dentist, you make good money as a physician, and you know, you don’t have the time. I just don’t, I’m not going to take the time, you know, I wish I could just pay somebody to do that. But you’ve got to start it. And if you start it, you can you can get people to finish it. But it takes your your mind your your, it takes there. If you had a great administrator, you know, you can help, they can help get people on your team to then memorialize what you what you’ve discovered. If you’re in surgery, and you, you know, you figured out a new instrument that would really, this would be so much better. If we did it this way. We’ll create it and then create the answer and make it don’t just say, oh, man, I wish we you know, today, you and I could go to the hub in North Little Rock, and we could meet with someone that would that would take our idea and get it put it on a 3D printer and get in and make it real make something there. And then if you were working with Boston Scientific rep, if you use their products a lot, then you want to you contacted me saying hey, I’m interested in talking with one of your people about this thing because it’s better. And I like your company. I like that stuff happens all the time. It happens. But it happens all the time. But it it’s rare. Because so they’re just so busy. And don’t take the time with it but if you want to you can and there are people you know me others that we help you know we can help develop those help do those things through the Venture Center here in Little Rock through Innovate Arkansas, you know, part of the you know, that group, the hub, I mean, there’s lots of Resources just right here in a small city like little rock. So in a larger market, there’s even more. I mean, there’s there’s incubators and business accelerators in any major city, any major city? And, you know, use them.

RJ Martino  

Yeah, well, so just to kind of put an exclamation point from what I heard, which is doctors are forefront of seeing problems and it’s it’s it’s such a specific niche that they might have a solution that will be useful around the country, introducing themselves the problem and a solution is is something that happens at venture centers and incubators around the country. Yeah, and you’ve got people in the in these areas that will help you develop will help you make a process and you know, even build a business around you. This isn’t something that they they may or they may want to quit their job and do that only or they may not have to.

David DePoyster 

Very rare I don’t they don’t want it. I mean, it’s but I’ve got an idea, and I want to develop it. And I think it’s it’s got some worth. I’ll give you another real world example. He just here and in. And this is a young person. So yes, we’re young, a nurse, few years ago, graduated, was working on the ward here and one of our major hospitals and saw what a problem it was. IVs getting dislodged whether they be here or here, you know the rollover in bed get up but you know, you’ve seen people walking with a little pole, if you’ve ever been in a hospital room. Yeah, you know what that’s like, children’s hospitals have a much higher rate of, of those being dislodged. You know, it’s not like they come out and blood squirting all over the place. And people are dying, that can happen in picc lines and different things, but about 5% of every IV every day in our hospitals get dislodged 5%. That’s a lot. Yeah, okay, a lot. And he saw the problem, he came, went to the to the Innovation Hub, went to the Innovate Arkansas, and just had an idea stressed out, you know, hey, here’s, I want to create this. And when I saw it, first thing I saw it, I went over to Warwick, who was over that program at the time, I said, I want to invest in that, I will fund it, I will do it, I want to work with this with this guy. And yeah, we’ve raised almost 6 million now. We’re right on the cusp of FDA approval for this product that is basically a breakaway valve. You know, you pull hard and it breaks before the tape comes off. And it’s a small thing, but there’s a, Lord willing, there’ll be a lot of those over time over that from that idea, you know, he’s created, over close to $6 million has been in and been raised and invested. And that can be done by lots of clinicians, there’s lots of problems to solve, and just coming up with that solution.

Jordan Smith  

And a lot of people out there really smart individuals like you that can help them bring that idea to fruition. You know,

David DePoyster  

yeah, through these centers, you know, I work for Optum. So I mean, I don’t develop individual things and delay all the time, but as a mentor, and then as an investor with the, with the different entities. Yeah. And then it’s usually being a connector, like I will connect you to people within the industry, because I’ve worked with or sold to a different company in the past. And, you know, and obviously, I’ve connected with Optum, I had a call this morning with a, you know, a startup that I think has a great product that Optum can utilize and could add to our portfolio. So I look for those things, and then connect them with the right people within Optum. To see if that’s something you know, we would want to do Optum give them credit. Optum is a very open to new things, new technologies. And if it’s best for the patient, quite frankly, if you just put the patient first It sounds so cliche sounds so sure, he’s just saying that, but if it helps patients, if it helps them, we can make a bit we can build a business on it. 

RJ Martino  

Sure. Yeah. I mean, I think that’s just crucial. I want to ask another question that you might be able to speak to because I think you are in a great spot where you know, from the outside looking in, everybody would think you’re in a perfect position to just do do nothing like be done. But a lot of us can’t just stop working and I think there are some physicians that you know, medicine They might have used enough, there might ready to look at that next phase. Take us back to that time, whenever you got back into Optum, you didn’t have to, but you said you wanted to build relationships, you wanted to keep working, knowing what was going through your mind? You know, if you went back to that time period, what were you, what were you doing at the time?

David DePoyster

At the time I was looking to do is that one of those inflection points in your life. And I had had not done a good job of developing buddies in my life, you know, people that didn’t care what I did didn’t do anything that weren’t related to my work, which I love my friends, my work friends and everything, but you don’t hang out with them. You don’t, I just didn’t, I didn’t have buddies, I lost that along the way, raising kids, having my wonderful wife spending time with them, traveling, doing business. And I really wanted that. So I took up golf, and I have made so many friends. And they don’t have anything to do with my business, I don’t have anything, we just enjoy each other’s company. And that’s been very, very helpful for me. And, and also the, it was a time for me to not manage and be responsible for the whole ship. But be on the ship. And I liked I liked working and I liked making friends. And I like doing it. So from a personal standpoint, that that was that was that inflection point for me, where I didn’t have any fun to manage, I didn’t have any of that. And now I could just do some other things I got an opportunity to work with Optum through relationships that I had, and to do things totally different than I’ve ever done. And, and I really loved it. And I really enjoy what I’m doing. Because I get to, I get to try to improve healthcare. And really, there were five companies at the time. This is you know, five years ago, almost five years ago, there were five companies that I thought could really maybe make a difference in healthcare. The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, I applied, I just went on indeed, and I applied for a job. Because I thought, yeah, I want to be a part of being substantively positive to the healthcare because that’s all I’ve worked in, that’s all I’ve known is healthcare. And I want to I want to be a part I want to profit from it too. So it’s not a fill, I know, I’m not a philanthropist at this point, I want to make money, but I want to do good and do good. And Bill and Melinda Gates, Google Health, Amazon health was just starting over, then I did an interview for them, I think they can now you know, they can be a positive force in certain ways they’re gonna try to, and all that. And then Optum was, was one of them and Oracle health. And I Optum, it just it just materialized, it was just very organic, very natural. And why I’m thankful that we can’t, because there’s so much good we can do with an organization that has so broad that we can really, you know, Specialty Pharmacy is a it’s a it’s a big deal, especially pharmacy, these are special pharmaceuticals, a lot of biologic, IVIG, those types of specialty drugs. Now, those drugs this year will represent 50% of the drug spend that health plans have so 50% of that are these special guests and what they represent 1-2% of the employees. So one to 2% of the employees need 50% or so of the of the cost that you spend on all the drugs that you pay for. So, you know, that’s an area we’re, we’re addressing, we’re working on that area, we’re doing creative things to to reduce those, or then add value in other places and do things that I mean that that you can do that when you have scale. And Optum has the scale to do that. We’ve got an oncology pharmacy that it’s it’s a it’s I wouldn’t say a unicorn, but it’s extremely rare. It’s very specialized and, and like large oncology practices. Now, you know, they they mix their own medications, for infusion for chemotherapy. Well, that’s okay. But there are new rules. The US pharmacopoeia has released some some new rules and now the majority of all those drugs are considered hazardous chemicals. So we can do those. Shipped them to the facility, ready to go bagged already spotted Ready to go? So we reduced the cost, because instead of opening a whole vial, and then because they’re all custom, it’s all custom you come in, you get tested, you based on certain factors, you know, seven grams of that 10 grams gets used, well, those three grams get thrown away, and a health plan still pays for them? Wow, well, we don’t we mix up and we allow you to build a health plan exactly what was used. Now that cost the doctor some because the doctor makes them makes the a margin. But when you’re at risk, like the majority of our physicians, and the majority of our providers are going to be in at risk, value added relationships, those are opportunities to show. Look, look what we’re doing. We just worked with a group recently where we showed them, they they’re at risk for over a million lives. And we can show them how they can save the health plan that they’re that they’re a part of 150 million a year, just in wasted drugs. So that that’s exciting. I love that. I mean, that helps the system, maybe that helps all of us, helps the patient patient gets there, they don’t have to wait on testing, they don’t have to wait on, they don’t have to wait on their drugs to be mixed. They, it’s done in a class 10,000 clean room, much better than what you can do, you know, most sites, we it’s just it’s it’s the it’s the box, you know, it’s we’re doing all four of those things, not just the triple aim, but the quadruple aim, it makes it better for the provider, it’s safer for the provider. It’s, it’s great. So and those are things I get excited about that we that we can do.

RJ Martino  

I think a lot of our audience can kind of align with what you’re what you’re thinking and can align with what you guys are doing there at Optum. But I also think we’re you were is where a lot of our audience thinks too, you know, a lot of them have just worked so hard to become physicians that they feel like they wasted their youth. Not wasted by any means. But you know what I mean, they’ve they missed out on the buddy system. Now. they’ve raised families and, you know, their their kids are out of the house, and they’ve made enough money, but they are still have a little bit of what is the next chapter. And so I think what you spoke to is where a lot of them find themselves. And so you’ve spoken to the investment opportunity, because often they’re thinking about stopping doing medicine and looking at investing. You’ve spoken about kind of moving into just finding friends, not just building, you know, work friends, but finding real friends after that. If you’re speaking to those guys in that kind of timeframe in that psychological mind frame. Have you got any other tips for them if they’re in the same position that you were whenever you describe your fork in the road?

David DePoyster 

Yeah, it I, everybody is different. But and so I can speak for myself. But when you’re at that juncture, then look for what would make you happy. And I knew what made me happy. That doesn’t mean don’t do things you don’t want to do because you know, I do things I don’t want to do every day, you know, there, you have to do hard things, you have to get this finished. I don’t want to do that spreadsheet. I really am tired of that. But I have to do it. So so then they’re used to that. I mean any any any successful person is used to doing those those things. But I had never really looked when I was at a point where I could really go, what would make me happy. What would really, the things I got into were very organic. It was you know, I didn’t have a grand plan in my life. I mean, I got into orthopedics because I met a guy at a at a training for Dale Carnegie. And he happened to be in the orthopedic business. And we were going into Pizza Hut six months later at the same time. And both in each other and he goes Hey, man, you ought to come interview. I mean, that’s how I got into it. I mean, it was that was it was that complex. And that planned out I didn’t know. And I have a one of my my best friend from childhood and still my best one of my best friends ever is an orthopedic surgeon, retired now. But he knew when he was 13 years old, he wanted be an orthopedic surgeon, and he’d broken his arm. And he’s like, hey, I want to be a surgeon that that’s cool. I want to do that. I’ve never had that. Just never have had that I’m a, I’m my hummingbird. Now I like doing different things. And I get bored and there are a lot of physicians in that in that same boat. So so we got an opportunity look at the challenges in your field or in your house in your relationship, I don’t know. And if you have answers, if you have solutions, if you have ideas, then then codify them, and develop them. And some of them are going to work. And some of them are going to become real products, solutions, apps, they’re gonna, if you have a need other people have, yeah. And then in medicine, we’re looking to make incremental improvements. And we do that by the people that actually know what’s going on improving it.

RJ Martino  

Well, this has been phenomenal. And I think, you know, wrapping this up in a nice bow, you nailed it, if you are in that fork in the road, it is think about what you want in the future, like, have a vision. And it goes back to what Jordan said, with, with kind of our original thought process on building a practice, you know, a practice or these guys who own their own, it is there to support the owners of the practice. And the owners of the practice are never happy, whenever guys like me swoop in and say, I got a solution that’s going to fix all of your problems, even when I’m right. And I’ve been right, shown them, and they’re not happy. And I’m thinking how in the world, are you not happy, you said this was your problem, I brought you the solution, you didn’t have to lift a finger. And often it’s because it doesn’t match what their vision of the future looks like. It’s like we have to, tell me where we’re going. You’ve got to tell your team, your staff, your vendors, what you want out of the future, they can help you build a strategy that gets you there. And then they can actually execute the tactics for you. You don’t even have to tactically to do the work. But you’ve got to have a vision for your own future.

David DePoyster  

And so while having a plan is key, having a plan is key. And like I tell my, my children, my students, when I teach, and people have worked with me and say you, I always have a vision of what, or I’m like a mountain in the distance, you know, beautiful place that I’m going towards. And it changes over time. You know, sometimes it changes, you know, I see another one that I want. I want to I know and that’s fine. That’s cool. So I always have a vision of where I want to go. But concentrate on the foot, that next football the next footstep, what’s right in front of me today. That’s the most important is doing that. Knowing that it was based off of the direction of that where I wanted to go. And I always have an idea, I want to feel good. I want to I want to be happy, I want that I want to move towards that always. But it takes being nice to my sweetheart. Right now. It takes doing those things right now. That gets me there. Yeah, and it sounds simpleton. But in a practice, you know, I’ve seen this in many, many, many physicians, and I’ve worked to develop products and solutions with physicians. And they are they they have to really throttle down and know that things don’t happen fast. Things like developing something, it takes time. But it’s worth the time. If you if you do it, and your team can help you, but it takes time. But it’s worth it if you want to create something, versus just keeping your business and yeah, we’re gonna add a, you know, we’re gonna add an MRI, we’re gonna do do these things. That’s cool. Those are all those are all good things. But is there a problem we can find a solution for. And anyway, I’m harping on solving problems.

Jordan Smith  

That’s a great concept, we use the mountain analogy all the time. So, you know, I love that as kind of a, a bookend to this whole thing, which is, you know, have have a goal in mind, if there’s a if there’s a problem, like, take some time and figure out what a solution might be. Because you might be the person who comes up with that solution. You know, be patient with it, but also look to see where your next foothold is, is you’re climbing that mountain. Because, you know, if not just look at that mountain and say, Man, I’d like to get to the top of that thing. But you just stand there, you’re not going to get to the top of it. You know, so. What so what’s the old saying a, a goal without a plan is is is just going to be a wish cool. You can sit here and wish that you get to the top of that thing all the time, but start planning out those footsteps toward it. And don’t be afraid to put yourself out there and engage with people who have who have been to that same mountaintop before like David. So, David, if there’s listeners out there and they say, Man, this really resonates with me. I’d love to learn either more about Optum or talk more work to David or hear more about his story, what are some good ways you might be able to reach out to you?

David DePoyster 

Well, I can be contacted easily, I’ll be glad to share my contact information with you all and, and put put that on the on the YouTube, I believe, and everything is easily accessible obviously, through you guys. You know, if someone reaches out to you all and they want to want to contact, I’m more than happy to be a connector. And if I can help directly I will. But if I know who could help develop a particular thing or guide something or even within Optum of your time, you know, things we’ve talked about different businesses within Optum I can help get people to the right folks at Optum. I’m happy to do that. That’s, that’s, that’s the spice of life.

Jordan Smith  

Very cool. Well, look, check out the show notes. We’re gonna put David’s contact information in there. And yeah, he’s always been very generous with his time, despite how busy he is. David, I want to say that we appreciate you, I think we’re probably going to ask you to be on again sometime in the future. Because I could I can just, I could just picture all the listeners out there while they’re on their morning jog or stuck in traffic, or sitting at the house, doing whatever, just shaking their head with so many of the stuff that you’re saying. So I want to say thank you and David DePoyster.

David DePoyster  

Thank you guys. See ya.

RJ Martino  

Thanks, David. Jordan, thats was fun. David is just a guy, like one of the guys that I’d love to just have around me more often his energy is contagious. And his thoughts, you know, he talks to physicians all the time. And sometimes we forget that as physicians, we’re just humans too. And we need that real human connection. What stuck out to you know, I

Jordan Smith  

mean, I mean, just that just looking up and you know, it’s we always joke about, it’s not what, you know, it’s who, you know, he mentioned that being an important part in a couple different parts of his career. You know, that and also the the E-Myth, which which I know, we follow, he talked about that book being a big influence for him and his investment group and everybody that he works with. So, a couple of those things, if you guys haven’t read that book, I would encourage you to.

RJ Martino  

Oh, man, it was a I felt like it was reading my diary, the first time I read it, and just opened my eyes to what a real business should look like, even though I thought I was running a successful business. So just double down on that completely.

Jordan Smith  

Absolutely. And David’s a great guy, super personable if you guys have questions or want more information, we’ve got all the links in the show notes. Reach out to him do us a favor, he he loves to hear from you, especially if you’re out there and you know, even if you just want somebody to kind of bounce some ideas off of he’s super open with that type of stuff. So like, subscribe, comment, we we appreciate all of your input. If there’s certain topics or or you like it when we go off course like this a little bit. We’d love to hear about it from you guys. So like, subscribe, comment, especially if we earned it and until next time, thanks, RJ.

RJ Martino  

Thanks, Jordan.